Crackle tile problem

[Coles]

Hi,

As part of our restoration we installed Crackle tiles but for some reason they did not seal them and then the grout went on. Now we have a massive issue with the grout going into the cracks.

The issue is made worse by the fact it's patchy. So I tried putting grout over the patches but they dont seem to take.

Any suggestions or start again?

 

[stuart45]

Have you asked the tilers what they are going to do?
Sometimes, especially when using a darker grout, they are left unsealed to highlight the crazing.

 

[Cubist]

I have to admit I don't understand what the problem is here. These are glazed tiles where the crackle effect is produced either when the tile is first pressed or the when glaze is sprayed onto its surface. There are no actual cracks or crevices in the tiles surface. Also, such tiles do not require that they be 'sealed' - the glaze does that job perfectly well.

 

[Coles]

Have you asked the tilers what they are going to do?
Sometimes, especially when using a darker grout, they are left unsealed to highlight the crazing.

It's a bit of an awkward situation as they are suggesting it was because we chose that colour. The person who did it is my partners friends husband, but it is their trade. I even purchased the sealer and was told it was put on later despite my questioning.

I could kick myself as I was going to put a coat on all the tiles prior to them even going up.

I am really gutted as I have spent so much time perfecting the original features and now so many of the tiles look like the back of a dusty builders van with someone putting their finger through a line of dust.

I don't think there is really anything I can do apart from attempt to put the grout over the light patches to see if it takes into those cracks. At least it would be uniform. But one attempt didn't work.

 

[Coles]

I have to admit I don't understand what the problem is here. These are glazed tiles where the crackle effect is produced either when the tile is first pressed or the when glaze is sprayed onto its surface. There are no actual cracks or crevices in the tiles surface. Also, such tiles do not require that they be 'sealed' - the glaze does that job perfectly well.

The issue is that sealing stops the grout going into the cracks. The dark grout has gone into the cracks leaving a patchy finish.

In this pic you can see what the tiles should look like (the below one). The grout as made the cracks darker which isnt the end of the world but it has left it patchy, as in on most of the tiles it has left lighter patches.

 

[stuart45]

I know some tilers will advise customers that crackle tiles can be left unsealed before grouting when using a darker grout. Others say that they should always be sealed first. The darker grout highlights the cracks, which is the look some people want. Unfortunately yours is a bit patchy.

 

[Coles]

I know some tilers will advise customers that crackle tiles can be left unsealed before grouting when using a darker grout. Others say that they should always be sealed first.

This pic might help a little more.

You can see the lighter lines where the grout didnt go into the cracks. Which to me look like finger lines through dust.

I thought maybe putting the grout on those areas again might help. But an attempt on one tile didn't do anything.

 

[stuart45]

You might have to get some advice from a tiling company on this. For example, using a grout remover might make it worse. I quite like the look of the crazing being highlighted with darker grouts, but it's only my taste.
Generally it's advised they are sealed first.

 

[Coles]

You might have to get some advice from a tiling company on this. For example, using a grout remover might make it worse. I quite like the look of the crazing being highlighted with darker grouts, but it's only my taste.
Generally it's advised they are sealed first.

Thank you. I don't mind it going darker its just the unevenness. I am trying again to put the grout over the lighter patches but it doesn't seem to be working.

I will have to see if anything can be done.

 

[Cubist]

Well, I thought I'd got to an age where little surprises me and I'm a little shocked right now that a significant surprise has come along concerning something close to my family roots - a number of my direct ancestors owned and worked in the North Staffordshire tileries and yours truly is the godson of a managing director of one of them. To learn that tile manufacturers are deliberately producing products that specifically fail to meet the key fundamental feature of a glazed ceramic tile, i.e. the exposed face thoroughly resists water penetration, is little short of stunning. To then learn that those manufacturers and suppliers then promote the use and sale of sealants designed to replace that resistance to water has me more than a little gobsmacked but convinced that the consumer is being exploited and abused.

Coming back to the technical problem @Coles is facing. You need to understand that you will not now be able to get a uniform and consistent exposed pattern and shade graduation over those tiles - it is, and would be impossible, unless it was a printed design applied during the manufacturing process. The 'crackle' effect is achieved by a manufacturing process in which, after the glaze solution is sprayed over the surface face of the tiles the normal firing process in the kiln, which melts the glaze materials to form a solid coat over the tile, is interrupted during the normal cooling process and the resulting thermal 'shock' produces the cracks and fissures in the tiles surface glaze. The patterns formed by these cracks and fissures will be entirely random and inconsistent as will the depth, width and length of any given crack - as a consequence the grout used to fill the joints will also, if it were fine enough, have filled and discoloured the cracks to lesser and greater extents.

Frankly, there is no way that you ever will, or could have, achieved a uniform and consistent pattern, distribution or colour shading of the crackle finish and bluntly I believe your expectations concerning the final finish were and are still incorrectly high.

 

[Coles]

Well, I thought I'd got to an age where little surprises me and I'm a little shocked right now that a significant surprise has come along concerning something close to my family roots - a number of my direct ancestors owned and worked in the North Staffordshire tileries and yours truly is the godson of a managing director of one of them. To learn that tile manufacturers are deliberately producing products that specifically fail to meet the key fundamental feature of a glazed ceramic tile, i.e. the exposed face thoroughly resists water penetration, is little short of stunning. To then learn that those manufacturers and suppliers then promote the use and sale of sealants designed to replace that resistance to water has me more than a little gobsmacked but convinced that the consumer is being exploited and abused.

Coming back to the technical problem @Coles is facing. You need to understand that you will not now be able to get a uniform and consistent exposed pattern and shade graduation over those tiles - it is, and would be impossible, unless it was a printed design applied during the manufacturing process. The 'crackle' effect is achieved by a manufacturing process in which, after the glaze solution is sprayed over the surface face of the tiles the normal firing process in the kiln, which melts the glaze materials to form a solid coat over the tile, is interrupted during the normal cooling process and the resulting thermal 'shock' produces the cracks and fissures in the tiles surface glaze. The patterns formed by these cracks and fissures will be entirely random and inconsistent as will the depth, width and length of any given crack - as a consequence the grout used to fill the joints will also, if it were fine enough, have filled and discoloured the cracks to lesser and greater extents.

Frankly, there is no way that you ever will, or could have, achieved a uniform and consistent pattern, distribution or colour shading of the crackle finish and bluntly I believe your expectations concerning the final finish were and are still incorrectly high.

At what point are my expectations high?

We chose these tiles because of how they looked.

I had expectations they would remain the colour I chose, which would have been the case if myself or the installer had sealed them beforehand.

Now that has not happened I have zero expectations , hence why I posted to see if there was a solution.

Even my daughter asked if they needed cleaning as it looks like someone has put their finger through a line of dust. That was not the look I was going for.

 

[Cubist]

Would it be safe to assume the surface of the tiles has been thoroughly washed down and polished after the grout dried? It sounds silly I know but this finishing stage is sometimes overlooked.

In terms of expectations; right now there is virtually no chance of achieving your original goals unless you strip off and replace all those tiles to then replace them with new and then strictly follow the manufacturers guidance regarding sealing and grouting them.

 

[Coles]

Would it be safe to assume the surface of the tiles has been thoroughly washed down and polished after the grout dried? It sounds silly I know but this finishing stage is sometimes overlooked.

In terms of expectations; right now there is virtually no chance of achieving your original goals unless you strip off and replace all those tiles to then replace them with new and then strictly follow the manufacturers guidance regarding sealing and grouting them.

Thank you. I will clean and polish again and see what happens.

The next best outcome was to replicate the dark parts across the areas without it but as you explained its never going to be even and I gather grout has gone into the deeper or wider cracks only. So when I try the grout again on the lighter areas it doe not do anything.

I have got lots of the tiles left over so I think we will need to start again at some point. Sealing first and using a cream grout.

Or I might end up living with it.