Is it possible to determine the age of a front door by the hinge!

[dadio77]

Hello All,

I recently moved into what I assumed was a late Georgian property (c.1830) but have been told by the Conservation Officer that it is very early Victorian (c.1849). Therefore the front door that I didn't think was original, could well be! I have tried some google searches but it's difficult to tell, however it is hung on what I think are unusual hinges, and I'm wondering if these would give an indication of the age of the door?



Granted, the door could have been re-hung on original hinges so may not help, but would give me an idea at least! The reason I am looking into this is because I was considering buying a reclaimed Georgian era six panel door to tie in to the rest of the frontage (i.e. symmetrical 12 panel windows and porch), but it could just be a quirk of the period the property was built with this more 'Victorian-esque' four panel door.

Any help or pointers would be appreciated!

 

[malcolm]

You've got a riser hinge there which tries to close the door. I've got one of those on a 1921 door. There is evidence of a recess for a much taller hinge filled in so the riser hinge isn't original to the door frame. Can't see any matching filler on the door so probably a replacement door.

 

[Toby Newell]

'Hawk Eye' Malcolm has a good point, but yes, in answer to your original question door furniture and ornament in general can often be used to help date furniture and things like doors. At a partially educated guess I would think rising butt hinges date from around 1880. In your case I don't think it helps. Is your property urban or rural? Smaller rural properties were less adherent to the prevailing whimsy of fashion. Many Georgian doors were 3, 5 or 6 panel but there are plenty of higher multi panel doors, especially earlier on. It's very hard to date the end of a period as fashions didn't necessarily always die with the monarch. The glass has obviously been replaced. Looking at the rest of the door furniture as a whole, incredibly roughly, I would make a partially educated guess that it is late 1800's at the earliest. Nice (and peculiar) handrail.

 

[dadio77]

Thanks to both of you for responding, very interesting views and much appreciated!

It's a rural property and was one of only two, two storey properties in the settlement, the rest being chartist bungalows, which is why I think it was built earlier than the CO believes (the official listing estimates 1830-1840, the settlement was finished in 1849). I did a bit of digging following Malcolm's original response and would agree riser hinges look to postdate the house; the CO was keen to point out that the original build was quite frugal in it's nature, and therefore I can't see them trendsetting by using riser hinges some 50 years before they were used more widely!

I was almost certain the glass was not original in any case, and if we do end up keeping this door, I would be looking to replace those panes which really let it down. The handrail is beautiful, that does appear to be original from what we were told, but again goes against the 'frugal' nature of the property's beginnings! I would have dated that much later as well if I'm honest, but it's not going anywhere in any case, it's more wanting to tie in the door that I am working on.

 

[Toby Newell]

Please post more photos of handrail, esp. end cap, not sure seen that before.

 

[CliffordPope]

We've got two pairs of riser hinges like that, in sitting room and the main bedroom. The house was built in 1875-80, so I assumed they are original.

They are a nice idea - rising to clear the carpet etc- but a pain the way the door won't stay open. Door stops are also a pain when you kick one in bare feet during the night.

 

[Toby Newell]

We've got two pairs of riser hinges like that, in sitting room and the main bedroom. The house was built in 1875-80, so I assumed they are original.

They are a nice idea - rising to clear the carpet etc- but a pain the way the door won't stay open. Door stops are also a pain when you kick one in bare feet during the night.

mmmm, flipping super annoying if you are coating floors, I hate them.

 

[dadio77]

Please post more photos of handrail, esp. end cap, not sure seen that before.

Here you go, Toby!

 

[Toby Newell]

View attachment 13519View attachment 13520View attachment 13521
Here you go, Toby!

Fantastic. Shame someone sandtex'd the newels and bannisters. Looks like walnut, impressive bit of timber.

 

[keithevans595]

Probably a bit of a longshot for dating the house, but could you identify it on any old maps?
I usually use https://maps.nls.uk/ to look for old properties when I'm ancestor hunting.

 

[dadio77]

Probably a bit of a longshot for dating the house, but could you identify it on any old maps?
I usually use https://maps.nls.uk/ to look for old properties when I'm ancestor hunting.

Thanks Keith, the earliest map is the late 1880's, however this prompted me to do a bit more searching and I have found a public consultation, published by the council itself, that states the house was built before the land for the chartist village was purchased, as opposed to afterwards which was the CO's view. I think with this, and others views on the door, it's highly unlikely to be original! Now I just need to see if the CO agrees...!

 

[Toby Newell]

Probably a bit of a longshot for dating the house, but could you identify it on any old maps?
I usually use https://maps.nls.uk/ to look for old properties when I'm ancestor hunting.

Not a longshot, a sensible shot! Primary evidence, for example legal deeds or a receipt of sale is the best, followed by maps, plans, mentions in books, surveys or other literature, photos etc. Dating a structure invloves everything you can think of. Noting aesthetic styles, styles of construction, materials and material patination are adjuncts to this.

 

[ThornhillMike]

Can you not trace it back through UK Land Registry? Here on the Isle of Man all land records are digitised from 1901 onwards (with the rest in hard copy in the Manx Museum). I have copies of all the related transactions for our house from its erection in 1844 to the day we bought it. Might be worth a try...

 

[ThornhillMike]

Fantastic. Shame someone sandtex'd the newels and bannisters. Looks like walnut, impressive bit of timber.

With the danger of this turning into a 'what's my bannister made of?" thread I'd be curious of your opinion of this one Toby...

 

[Toby Newell]

With the danger of this turning into a 'what's my bannister made of?" thread I'd be curious of your opinion of this one Toby...View attachment 13537View attachment 13538

another very lovely bit of walnut

 

[Toby Newell]

With the danger of this turning into a 'what's my bannister made of?" thread I'd be curious of your opinion of this one Toby...View attachment 13537View attachment 13538

looks like it has been stripped at some point (only half bleached) and the bare wood waxed, which is sacrilege really as it would of been French polished.

 

[ThornhillMike]

looks like it has been stripped at some point (only half bleached) and the bare wood waxed, which is sacrilege really as it would of been French polished.

It may be my photo Toby (we've mp lighting at the moment so it was by torchlight). The bannister rail up the stairs does have an odd (mottled) patina to it, as if it has been 'treated'. I'll take some more photos tomorrow when I'm there. I'll also need to swat up on your 'wood finishing' guide...

 

[ThornhillMike]

another very lovely bit of walnut

Good stuff, that's pleasing. There's three floors of bannister!. Thanks Toby.

 

[Toby Newell]

It may be my photo Toby (we've mp lighting at the moment so it was by torchlight). The bannister rail up the stairs does have an odd (mottled) patina to it, as if it has been 'treated'. I'll take some more photos tomorrow when I'm there. I'll also need to swat up on your 'wood finishing' guide...

It's been stripped and waxed and partially bleached, which happens naturally.

 

[ThornhillMike]

It's been stripped and waxed and partially bleached, which happens naturally.

Ah okay, thank you. Restorable? (I know it would be by you, I'm asking if us amateurs could...).