The Ultimate Bodge

[Keithj]

I've just been sorting through the thousands of photographs I took during the restoration and extension of our house. I didn't find the ones I was looking for, but I did find one I'd forgotten. I call it "the ultimate bodge".

This is what was revealed when the planks (cut in/planted on and painted to look like original oak) were removed from below the bedroom window:

Yes, it's from outside the house, about six feet up the south wall.

 

[Penners]

That's pretty typical of the "repairs" made to so many timber-frame buildings, Keith. And of course it's a testament to the robustness of that form of structure that the building can accommodate such lash-ups and still remain standing.

But please be careful how you use the word "bodge"! Bodging is, in fact, an ancient and highly skilled craft. I've never understood why it has become so misused as a derogatory term.

Here's a bodger at work at his pole lathe, in his woodland shack:

 

[d49xc]

The term "Bodging" so I was told also originates from the process of putting a weak lime/horsehair mixture on the underside of roof tiles (obviously from the inside after the roof is finished) on the tile 'headers' /batterns to prevent angled rain etc being driven in while still allowing the roof to breathe.
This would be when the inside of roofs were simply the underside of the tiles.

(Can't be ar*** to go into my roof to take picture of it in situ)

 

[JohnB]

(Can't be ar*** to go into my roof to take picture of it in situ)

Like this?

It's a bit of a "bodged" job, so I suppose it was just done to my roof where they thought it might leak!

 

[d49xc]

Yup,
On mine the wads of lime are much larger and cover more of the back face of the clay tile rather than the smaller width of yours just filling in the angle between the battern and the underside of the tile/slate
So the gap I have between the upper face of one battern and the lower face of the next one up is around 3 inches and the "bodge" probably covers 2" of that. Looking from the inside of the roof where the mixture has not fallen away you see more lime and battern than the underside of tiles.

Quite what the vertical bits are in your picture i've no idea........now that really does look a bodge

 

[Feltwell]

The term "Bodging" so I was told also originates from the process of putting a weak lime/horsehair mixture on the underside of roof tiles (obviously from the inside after the roof is finished) on the tile 'headers' /batterns to prevent angled rain etc being driven in while still allowing the roof to breathe.

I thought that was called "torching"? Might be a regional thing though - often building terms varied around the country.

 

[JohnB]

Quite what the vertical bits are in your picture i've no idea........now that really does look a bodge

That was one that I thought best showed what you were describing, to save you some effort :wink:. Here's a broader view!

 

[Flyfisher]

Interesting terms, though I must side with Feltwell regarding 'torching' and have always associated 'bodgers' with the sort of things in Penners' photo. I once read about such things being common in the woodlands around High Wycombe where the bodgers supplied the local furniture industry.
Edit - found this link: http://www.worldwidewords.org/weirdwords/ww-bod1.htm

Having spent a fair amount of time messing about with a pantiled roof, I can definitely understand the urge to seal the tile gaps with something, though in our case the resulting drafty attic space helped to keep our roof timbers in pretty good condition, given the poor state of the tile covering.

However, parts of our roof was waterproofed using a reed and lime mortar 'sarking' layer underneath the pantiles. Any water being driven underneath the pantiles would have just soaked into the mortar before drying out when the weather improved - a sort of 'lime mortar sponge'.

 

[Feltwell]

My experience of torching from Victorian plain clay tile roofs is that most of it has usually fallen off by now and it makes a hell of a mess. Our roofer reckoned it was used more to stop snow being wind-driven under the tiles than anything, and it also did more harm than good - it caused the battens to deteriorate at a faster rate than a non-torched roof. I can also testify that it makes taking the tiles off a pretty nasty job, being 3 storeys up and having powdered lime blowing in your eyes when the tiles are freed is not nice.

Breatheable roofing membrane is without doubt the way to go if anyone is re-roofing. Rather like plastic underground drainage, this is one application where a "modern" approach is a significant improvement over what was used in times gone by.

 

[Flyfisher]

Breatheable roofing membrane is without doubt the way to go if anyone is re-roofing. Rather like plastic underground drainage, this is one application where a "modern" approach is a significant improvement over what was used in times gone by.

Funny you should say that, this is a few days later . . . .

 

[Penners]

The term "Bodging" so I was told also originates from the process of putting a weak lime/horsehair mixture on the underside of roof tiles (obviously from the inside after the roof is finished) on the tile 'headers' /batterns to prevent angled rain etc being driven in while still allowing the roof to breathe.

I thought that was called "torching"?

Yes, torching is the term I've always heard for this process.

 

[JohnB]

Yes, torching is the term I've always heard for this process.

I thought torching is what arsonists do :shock:.

 

[Penners]

I believe that, in the argot of the criminal fraternity, such an interpretation may be placed upon the word.

But we PPUKers exist on a higher plane.

 

[middi]

" torching" , used in contest with rooves, battens an tiles, was a necessary evil to stop roof tops taking off like a kite in high wind. Peg tiles (and to some extend pan tiles), when hand made ( as they originally were), would have been very uneven and tended to "rock" when laid on the battens. The high winds, and rain, would have gained access within the building. Water entry would have been the least of the problems, if the building was reasonably enclosed ie- windows and doors- the wind pressure created within the building would have reacted like a hover-craft under the tiles speeding up the lift action.
In acient barns, where large doors were used to protect the contents within, torching was meticulously done. In " lesser" barns or where the doors could be left open, torching sometimes was omitted. A good " living" example can be seen at the acient "Cressing Barns".

Lime mortar ( or lime plus hair), even mud, was used to fill the uneven " rcking and rolling" gaps between the underside of the tiles and the batten.

Breatheable roof felt --- great invention---( :wink: )

Middi